What do you think about BL elements appearing in otome works?

[Yuki3548]

 

[Akizuki]

Reading the discussion in the thread is eye opening because I didn't know about fujoshi going as far as trashing otome game and removing the MC just to ship the LIs. You can definitely ship whomever you want but agreed, just keep it to your circle.

Personally I don't mind BL if it's happening to side characters and doesn't take the spotlight away from the MC and LI. It sucks if they're doing yaoi bait between the LIs in the game just to lure in the fujoshi. I'd much prefer to have yuri LI in my otome than yaoi between the LIs

 

[chizee]

I absolutely cannot accept this!! For example, in a certain game, a male lead has a friend (I won't name names to avoid spoilers)—I always thought they were great brothers, but as the story progressed, it turned out that the friend actually had other-than-brotherly feelings for the male lead! I was completely devastated when I got to that part. And on top of that, the male lead even said something nasty to the player character because of that friend.It's better not to have BL elements in otome games.

 

[3302325939]

I don't understand why they would include those elements when the BL game genre already exists. If that's the case, shouldn't they not label it as an Otome game? I completely disagree. Everyone plays games based on the genre, so it makes no sense to include such elements.

 

[kamilya5]

its so annoying I can't accept it at all too

 

[Beannie]

Wow, I guess I have a hot take that I do not mind the idea? I enjoy both otome and BL works, so I think it would be cool to have some sort of mix as long as it is well executed. But I guess it should not be called an otome game then, huh? Hottest take ever: I wanna more Bi LIs lmao

To be said yaoi baiting is annoying af, either do it properly or not at all lmao

I braced myself for the backlash lol

 

[ninnikuryona]

Wow, I guess I have a hot take that I do not mind the idea? I enjoy both otome and BL works, so I think it would be cool to have some sort of mix as long as it is well executed. But I guess it should not be called an otome game then, huh? Hottest take ever: I wanna more Bi LIs lmao

i guess it would make more sense if there was straight content in bl as well. but this is not the case, right? somehow baiting fujoshi in otome is acceptable, but baiting yumejoshi in bl is not?

 

[Honestymile]

a very flimsy excuse, especially considering the contents. theres older brother saying hes not gay but he would totally do the younger brother AND using actual bl term for it (ノンケ), younger brother claiming he likes it way more when older brother praises him instead of you praising him when his whole personality is being obsessed with you, younger brother screaming older brother's name first when cumming, and obviously you being turned into a nasty fujoshi that squirts just from seeing two men kiss. all of this without any brainwashing, and all of this when bl shit was never ever advertised

Wait, pardon me. For clarification, I'm actually not a fujoshi and I'm not trying to make excuses about that. I think I either missed or forgot the full context about the older brother for not being gay or bisex. Sorry, I didn't mean to provoke drama on this.

Tbh, i was actually pretty surprised when people got angry about that drama CD on Twitter, especially since I rarely follow news drama CD content myself—I only see it if it happens to show up on my timeline. Turns out it was quite controversial among otome fans. I thought people would like it, since a lot of otaku girlies usually enjoy that kind of content, but it seems it's actually the opposite, and its really something that shouldn't be mixed together.

And again, I apologize about my word earlier, didnt mean try to make anyone angry in here.

 

[ninnikuryona]

I thought people would like it, since a lot of otaku girlies usually enjoy that kind of content, but it seems it's actually the opposite, and its really something that shouldn't be mixed together.

yeah this is a popular misconception xd for whatever reason companies still think that female otaku = fujoshi by default, and then they act all surprised when it turns out that fujoshi and yumejoshi do not love mixing their food at all!
doesnt help that its only ever the otome genre that gets hit. never bl:(

 

[shironyan]

Wow, I guess I have a hot take that I do not mind the idea? I enjoy both otome and BL works, so I think it would be cool to have some sort of mix as long as it is well executed. But I guess it should not be called an otome game then, huh? Hottest take ever: I wanna more Bi LIs lmao

To be said yaoi baiting is annoying af, either do it properly or not at all lmao

I braced myself for the backlash lol

It would be a fake advertisement if they make BL elements in otome. If you want to buy otome related, people is expecting a hetero love, is always between heroine x LI.

I mean, just imagine if they advertisement BL game, but one of LI is love woman and fuck woman in front of BL protagonist? It's weird. Literally scam. This is why the genre is exist to avoid this.

In the end, Genre is separated is to avoid the fake advertisement. Imagine you buy burger, but you get pizza instead? Lmao

 

[ninnikuryona]

I mean, just imagine if they advertisement BL game, but one of LI is love woman and fuck woman in front of BL protagonist? It's weird. Literally scam. This is why the genre is exist to avoid this.

technically hadaka shitsuji has a couple of scenes like this.. though the difference is that you get a warning about straight content im pretty sure. and tehres almost no love involved (tomoaki aka the mc literally loves no one). and togo mito (the creator) himself is more of an anomaly since hes just doing whatever the fuck he pleases with his games WW

 

[shironyan]

technically hadaka shitsuji has a couple of scenes like this.. though the difference is that you get a warning about straight content im pretty sure. and tehres almost no love involved (tomoaki aka the mc literally loves no one). and togo mito (the creator) himself is more of an anomaly since hes just doing whatever the fuck he pleases with his games WW

Well... if that setting was messed up like that in the first place, it's ok i guess? as long as they give a warning about that.

But otome definitely can't work like that, because otome is aiming for yumejoshi anyway.

 

[Beannie]

i guess it would make more sense if there was straight content in bl as well. but this is not the case, right? somehow baiting fujoshi in otome is acceptable, but baiting yumejoshi in bl is not?

I am not very active member in either of these, so I am not sure what is actually acceptable or not. I would like to see honestly some "slack" from both sides tbh. It's like any ML in BL suddenly turns gay even when he was with women in past. Like hello? Bisexuality exists and I appreciate a lot when BL authors do not fear it.

 

[Beannie]

yeah this is a popular misconception xd for whatever reason companies still think that female otaku = fujoshi by default, and then they act all surprised when it turns out that fujoshi and yumejoshi do not love mixing their food at all!
doesnt help that its only ever the otome genre that gets hit. never bl:(

I mean, the additional trouble is they do not mix it very well. Fujo/yumejoshi baiting just for the sake of it is a bit... unfortunate to say the least

 

[ninnikuryona]

I am not very active member in either of these, so I am not sure what is actually acceptable or not. I would like to see honestly some "slack" from both sides tbh. It's like any ML in BL suddenly turns gay even when he was with women in past. Like hello? Bisexuality exists and I appreciate a lot when BL authors do not fear it.

the difference is in the intent though. what happened with virche and garumani was done with malice, because writers couldnt keep their fetishes in check. meanwhile the "im totally straight but this magical dick suddenly turned me very gay" trope is ever present in bl. even then, how many bl games can you recall with straight sex outright shown on screen? with voice acting, with the male character claiming he loves the woman more than anything in the world, with cgs and everything? not even a sex scene, but just a romantic scene overall?

 

[ninnikuryona]

I mean, the additional trouble is they do not mix it very well. Fujo/yumejoshi baiting just for the sake of it is a bit... unfortunate to say the least

because they shouldnt be mixed at all!!x3 the genres exist for a reason after all!

 

[Beannie]

It would be a fake advertisement if they make BL elements in otome. If you want to buy otome related, people is expecting a hetero love, is always between heroine x LI.

I mean, just imagine if they advertisement BL game, but one of LI is love woman and fuck woman in front of BL protagonist? It's weird. Literally scam. This is why the genre is exist to avoid this.

In the end, Genre is separated is to avoid the fake advertisement. Imagine you buy burger, but you get pizza instead? Lmao

Legit I would be intrigued

because they shouldnt be mixed at all!!x3 the genres exist for a reason after all!

Fair enough. To be said, even on AS, otome plaza hosts BL content. I understand and stand for labeling the stuff correctly, I guess I just don't care that much, since I enjoy both.

 

[ninnikuryona]

Fair enough. To be said, even on AS, otome plaza hosts BL content. I understand and stand for labeling the stuff correctly, I guess I just don't care that much, since I enjoy both.

animesharing does not represent the entire genre though? i agree that it should be called joseimuke plaza instead of otome, and the joseimuke (and amare and yuri) prefix should come into existence as well, but i dont really see the correlation
i also enjoy both otome and bl. and yuri and bishoujoge. i still dont want to see them being shoved into a single entity though, especially if this entity bears the "otome" label!! i hate it when female spaces get attacked;;

 

[Beannie]

animesharing does not represent the entire genre though? i agree that it should be called joseimuke plaza instead of otome, and the joseimuke (and amare and yuri) prefix should come into existence as well, but i dont really see the correlation
i also enjoy both otome and bl. and yuri and bishoujoge. i still dont want to see them being shoved into a single entity though, especially if this entity bears the "otome" label!! i hate it when female spaces get attacked;;

I agree. Granted my argument was a bit of road poiting at the mislabeling rather than devs purposefully including fujo/yume baits

 

[801_9ma]

Sorry for butting in in the middle of an ongoing convo, but the idea of stuff featuring both fujo & yume bait makes me think of the state of joseimuke gacha games in general.

I think it does take some balance to have bait that would satisfy both sides of the spectrum with a genre of game that is more general than something clearly labeled BL or otome, but you can tell when companies want their cake and eat it, leading to stuff that feels very... unsatisfying. Either it feels half-assed on the fujo bait, or half-assed on the yume bait. They just want their money without really putting in the effort because they know they can just roll with never committing to anything and it kind of sucks.

Overall I really do think that we would all benefit from stuff being clearly labeled so people avoid bad surprises, which makes the recent muddying of lines more bothersome.

(Also I'm really late but on the topic of gender and BL stuff since it was mentioned on the thread too... Yeah it's kinda ridiculous how blatantly transphobic some people in BL spaces are as soon as you remind them that transgender men exist and would like to see BL with dudes like them sometimes. They don't even remember trans dudes exist unless they've got a pregnancy fetish. I don't think they could even fathom that trans men who top exist LMAO.)

 

[ninnikuryona]

I think it does take some balance to have bait that would satisfy both sides of the spectrum with a genre of game that is more general than something clearly labeled BL or otome, but you can tell when companies want their cake and eat it, leading to stuff that feels very... unsatisfying. Either it feels half-assed on the fujo bait, or half-assed on the yume bait. They just want their money without really putting in the effort because they know they can just roll with never committing to anything and it kind of sucks.

imo its just a failed state from the beginning. because if you have a yume-heavy game, the sudden gayness of your favourite characters will just throw you off and make you question everything youve seen so far. and the records show that in a fujo-heavy environment, games that add yumebait are being trashed by fujoshi left and right. so you either should go full otome/joseimuke or full bl. preferably so, because bl games are in constant need of support.. but those who are supposed to support them prefer to waste their time arguing for bl addition to otome....;;

 

[801_9ma]

imo its just a failed state from the beginning. because if you have a yume-heavy game, the sudden gayness of your favourite characters will just throw you off and make you question everything youve seen so far. and the records show that in a fujo-heavy environment, games that add yumebait are being trashed by fujoshi left and right. so you either should go full otome/joseimuke or full bl. preferably so, because bl games are in constant need of support.. but those who are supposed to support them prefer to waste their time arguing for bl addition to otome....;;

Yeah, I kind of wish companies would just commit to something already, and I do wish the people you're talking about put their money where their mouth is instead of thinking they're defending gay rights by shipping their gay ships from non-BL stuff.

It'd be nice to get more BL gacha games out there since it's a popular game format, but unfortunately the lack of support they tend to get have made me hesitant to try any simply because they're more likely to shut down. Hell, the only BL gacha I know of that hasn't shut down yet is Nu:Carnival and I hate how grindy that game is so I never played it much. I'd rather just buy a game full price that way I know it'll never be gone (plus my wallet will thank me because I'm very prone to FOMO and gacha games are my enemies).

 

[ninnikuryona]

It'd be nice to get more BL gacha games out there since it's a popular game format, but unfortunately the lack of support they tend to get have made me hesitant to try any simply because they're more likely to shut down. Hell, the only BL gacha I know of that hasn't shut down yet is Nu:Carnival and I hate how grindy that game is so I never played it much.

theres zerowake gates, but its kinda.. broken? (thats what i heard at least, i havent played it myself) and it has ai shit in it. dont know if housamo counts, but its pretty popular within bara community because of furries. theres also xxl woofia i think? which is another bara gacha. i was about to say velvet react, but apparently it eosed a year ago lmao;; yeah the current state of bl gacha, and bl games in general, is a little depressing

 

[801_9ma]

theres zerowake gates, but its kinda.. broken? (thats what i heard at least, i havent played it myself) and it has ai shit in it. dont know if housamo counts, but its pretty popular within bara community because of furries. theres also xxl woofia i think? which is another bara gacha. i was about to say velvet react, but apparently it eosed a year ago lmao;; yeah the current state of bl gacha, and bl games in general, is a little depressing

Oh man, I can't believe I forgot about housamo lmao, I love the art in that game but for some reason I never played it too much. I should give it another try though! I'd never heard of XXL Woofia before so I think I'll check it out, thanks for mentioning it! (My problem with gacha games be damned...)

I've also heard about Zerowake Gates but I wasn't too drawn to the artstyle. I wasn't even aware it had AI stuff in it so now I don't even want to check it out.

I'm not too surprised about the lack of selection out there since live service games are a risky endeavor but it is upsetting, yeah.

 

[lambdadelta]

just for the sake of curiosity, why would even a background character who's gay/bi be a negative thing...? actually i'm not sure if i should be asking this since it seems like a subject that gets people pretty inflamed and i don't want the backlash lol but i'm not asking this maliciously, i want to understand what the thought process behind this distaste. (not applying to love interests, i've read everyone's reasons for it)