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General BL Games Discussion Thread

I just finished Paradise Kiwame (i played Paradise first game and then Paradise Musubi before) so here is my review ! I will spoil the game and i will spoil the 2 previous games too

General :
What I was hoping for Kiwame was : to see more of Azuma, to see more of Matsuda, to know more about the story/resolution, and i was reaaaally hoping for all the LIs to be more likeable. Because in the og game all LIs were bad : i didnt wish for Azuma to end up with any of them because all were abusive, in different/various ways. Kiwame answered my prayers for that (more or less...) so its great. This time, Matsuda stayed a nice person (except in 1 scene) and Mitsugi had waaaaay more moments were he acted nicely.
I really appreciate that this time we were able to follow the plan to get rid of Takaras familys stalking, because this was terribly rushed in the first game. Whats good is that with each route you get to understand different specifics of the plan, so the routes complete each other concerning that. Unfortunately, the routes do have a similar structure so it can get repetitive at the beginning. And concerning the plan itself well... Its not necessarily that i find it "bad" but i do have trouble believing this plan actually worked, knowing what we know about Takaras family. They are too wealthy, influential and physically strong for me to believe everything went that smooth kinda, but its still way better than in the other 2 games
I did miss the mysteries and "survival" context of the first game tho. In the first game, i did all the routes because i was very invested in the story on the island. In Kiwame, i did all routes because i was curious to see how different would the relationship between the characters be, but once i did my first full route i was way less invested in the story itself.
Like in Musubi, it was nice to have the possibility to see some POVs of the LIs!

Matsuda :
I was always weak for Matsuda. Like Azuma in the first game, i loved his nice big brother personality and how he cared for everyone + a lot of things about him were hot. But well, halfway through his route in the og game he became a horrible person and a violent abuser to Azuma. I didnt like it at all. And then his after story in the Musubi game is basically the continuation of the nice Matsuda, not the abuser Matsuda. I dont think it makes sense writing-wise BUT thats what i wished for so i was happy lol, FINALLY Azuma had a good husband !!! So i was really hoping for Kiwame Matsuda to be nice, and not an abuser. My prayers were mostly answered. He still acts VERY BAD in their first H scene but what i like about it is that its talked about, he apologized several times (if you played the first game you know that we didnt even get this crumb in it lmao), Azuma got very mad/screamed at him and punched him several times. Thats a nice small revenge for what happened in the og game.
Seeing Azuma being in control with Matsuda was something we needed. Damn, when he orders him to sck him and all that (with a shaky voice) ? Crazy. And Matsuda obeying him ? peak. I like that Azuma was also the one to decide he wants to do penetration and Matsuda was the one being worried. I love their Hscenes especially the last 2 ones (the cgs for the last one are peak btw). I loved all their cute moments : Matsuda singing a lullaby, him hugging Azuma on the bed to make him feel better, him tickling Azuma, him telling Azuma to stop blaming himself for Kido (love how Matsudas relationship with him was in Kiwame btw), all their friendly interactions, Matsuda bringing ice to Azuma even tho they were supposed to be mad at each other, Matsuda being flustered other Azuma drooling in front of his muscles, etc
They worked great as friends and they had a lot of good times with each other, thats why they also work great as lovers. It doesnt seem weird that they fell for each other because they enjoyed each others company from the very start. At least, Azuma crushing on Matsuda quite fast didnt seem unnatural. Them fighting and then making up was nice too. On another note, i do think that Azumas confessions when Matsuda was unconscious after they confronted Takaras father were a little too forced. It didnt feel natural at all and it was so obvious anyway that Matsuda wasnt dead and heard him say all those devoted things.
It was great to have Matsudas POV where he reflected on whether it was unethical for him to agree on hitting Azuma during s3x from time to time or not. Thats a though question knowing azuma was a victim of child beating and Matsuda being actually worried about that is needed. For me its fine because whether in Kiwame or Musubi, Matsuda only hits him during s3x when Azuma begs for it and it doesnt go further than 1 punch + it doesnt happen everytime they do it, only when Azuma decides. But also, Azuma is a very people pleaser person and he def asks it because he knows Matsuda gets aroused by it. But also, Azuma himself is aroused by it because of his people pleaser side, so it ends up being fine imo especially since Azuma takes pride in being the only one who indulged in this kink with Matsuda
Again, it really looks like they didnt know what to do with Matsuda as a character : a nice guy but with weird fetiches ? or a horrible abuser ? Why wasnt Matsuda like this in the og game ? It almost looks like Kiwame makes jokes about Matsuda of the og game, because in Kiwame they make him say things which are made to reminisce you of the og game. For ex in the end, when Azuma asks Matsuda what he likes about him, he first answers the same things than in the og game (which are only s3x-related or disminishing) and he follows right up with very romantic things that you expect from your other half. Or when they first do penetration, Matsuda doesnt go in very far because its hurting Azuma, and once Azuma realizes it he thinks to himself "what a nice person!!", while the Matsuda in the og game just violently ra/ped him. Or when he says he wouldn't do « stuff he doesn't like ». Is this cynical ?

Mitsugi :
finally a Paradise game where i dont hate Mitsugi. He is finally decent !! He aplologizes on several occasions, smiles at Azuma once they started getting closer and it happens quite early, and he does say very cute things to him. Finally a game where i can feel that Mitsugi learned to respect Azuma even tho their relationship started badly. In this game, it also makes more sense for Azuma to start to like Mitsugi, because Mitsugi showed the nicer part of himself. In the common route it feels very weird to have Azuma willingly chose to spend time with Mitsugi since they hate each other, but the game is self aware of that because when you first clicked that you want to spend time with Mitsugi, Azuma right away says "... seriously ?" its quite fun.
I dont understand why Mitsugi wasnt like that in the other games. Whats the point of a tsundere if he never shows any cute/nicer side ? Especially in the first game, Mitsugi always had the same expression and tone. In Kiwame he has maaany tones, its great. He learns to like Azuma but also the rest of the crew, which is a nice addition and also makes a lot of sense after everything theyve been through together. Im so glad his relationship with Azuma stopped being so one sided, we even have Azuma snapping back at Mitsugi. Mitsugi joking with Azuma is great too. Now they have an enemies to lovers relationship
The Kotohara thing is still so weird because it def looks like he wants to bang Azuma because he reminds him of his dead father figure for which he swears he never had any feeling other than respect and familial love but... eh? you sure about that Mitsugi ?
In the other 2 games, there was no moment of Mitsugi+Azuma that i liked, except a very few lines/moments which mostly came flat after a few mins because they were surronded by dirt (quite literally LMAO) but in Kiwame there was def good moments. Mitsugi spending the day trying to find a lost Azuma who was terrified ? Mitsugi asking Azuma in their first Hscene if he is "inviting him" in a soft voice ? Mitsugi telling Azuma to protect/take care of him ? Mitsugi telling Azuma it would be boring without him around ? Mitsugi shooting his own hand to protect Azuma ? Mitsugi telling Azuma that he doesnt have to feel ashamed of bottoming? Mitsugi trying to get to know Azuma and them actually having convos ?
In the other games Azuma didnt even get 1/10000 of this from Mitsugi. Also, whats even more crazy is that in Kiwame we actually see Mitsugi... helping to clean the house with Azuma. Well, he does it badly and rushes it, but still crazy it happened.
On another note, them becoming instantly very aroused whenever they brush past each other still makes no sense to me. This kind of thing can happen in real life but its mostly a mental thing and happens when you really love someone/learned to get really attracted to them/need a very specific context. Them feeling like this for each other magically/right off the bat is almost comical. It is better than in the og game tho since its at least a little less over the top. So it can be a little more believable at least ig
Idk what i think about their first penetrative H scene, because idk why it was dubcon coded. Azuma never got to say a thing in any of the stuff they did and he never seemed to understand what was happening. But the beginning of the kiss was great, for once i was actually rooting for a Mistugi+Azuma kiss. I think i love this kiss scene more than their actual hscenes
Unfortunately Azuma still becomes Mitsugis housekeeper in the end... i still find it tragic.

Takara :
I loved their friendship in the common parts/other LI routes of the og game. Its the same for Kiwame. I love their fireworks scene, it was so cute ! I love how Takara is always up to follow Azuma in his kid-like ideas, he def needs a friend like this. The amusement park is also great. But yeah I mostly see them as friends. Concerning the h scenes, I like their last one and it's the first takara h scene I found appealing, it's cute to see how he teases azuma and is also in awe when he hears his voice. The first h scene with the handjob was fine too, and I do appreciate that we finally see takaras D lmao. Takaras relationship with azuma is more believable in Kiwame than in the other games, so there's that. We also finally get to see more about his family of cannibals and btw that scene where azuma goes to the family's kitchen after the diner was great. Still not a pairing I like but in this game the writing of takaras route is way better.

Other routes :
Shimada : first i was bored in his route, but once he invited Azuma into the club for the first time things finally started to get interesting ! It was nice following this plot. Azuma not knowing gay vocabulary at all was funny. Shimada grew on me a little, and i also think he is one of the characters who didnt change at all from the first game because id say his character was already fine. Id say he is one of the best characters in this game. I dont like him paired with Azuma but i like him individually. His H scene with Azuma was good, it had a right balance of cute moments and "lets get this over with" moments. Because well he basically kept asking Azuma to let him fck him until Azuma gave up, so the scene reflected that too
Hongou : i like how Azuma describes him as the "perfect wife" lol. I also like that they care for each other, they have a nice relationship. Azuma touching hongous cheek was cute, same when he told him he didnt understand why he would be so unpopular. Them cooking together is also cute. That route is quite boring tho, and i do see them as friends rather than a couple. But it's the first time I'm seeing a LI in a bl who has a small penis AND who can't get hard, so it's interesting to see that. Hongou being cringe is part of his character too so it's nice they kept that in the h scene imo

Secret route/nanjou :
wow. Where to start lol? Well, the threesome and foursome. Didn't expect that. But it's great, tysm Paradise Kiwame for this. You can really see that in this route the creators were just like « let's go wild ». I could talk about how no one thought about « sharing » the burden and azuma got the shorter stick every single time but hey whatever, it's just to give them a reason to do 3/4somes. I'm just mad that except in the harem end, everyone just flees without azuma and never came back for him, like ??? You traitors !!! Azuma did so much for you and that's how he is thanked? ungrateful h0es. The harem end is great because azuma basically has all 3 main LIs has fwb, so he gets to enjoy life without becoming someone's « wife ». Good for him.
Nanjous route is just so funny. The way he and azuma both don't take the other one seriously is amazing. I thought it was going to be some sequestration/torture/slavery route but it's just a very funny route which almost seems like a parody of the series itself. I'm sure The writers really had fun writing the secret route! I did laugh several times. I don't really care about nanjou, he himself is also very stereotypical BUT for once it's not a critique since it just adds up to all of this secret route being some parody. The bad end is really terrifying tho…

So !!!! This game has so much content, it's very cool. The beginning of each route is very repetitive tho it's a shame. I was bored in some parts thats why it took me longer to finish, compared to the og game. But overall it's a good game, and the h scenes are very good.

I can say that I really like the paradise series. It's so good and so bad at the same time. I will miss Azuma for sure, and Matsuda too

I was super into the first Paradise VN until the actual "romantic" part where everybody becomes a toxic abuser T.T I felt so betrayed I stopped reading it entirely but when the eng translation came out I followed reviews and got to know the path the story takes (I would never have guessed XD). I read your review with interest, thanks for writing! It's a shame they can't nail a romantic route from start to finish, not even in the third game, although at least some elements improved. I felt like this story had such potential! I was very interested in the surviving part at the start.

Btw asking everybody, are there good survival VNs you'd recommend?
 
Maybe an odd question, but is DRAMAtical Murder still considered worth playing? I watched the anime a while ago and I just remember it being goofy. I never ended up putting time into the VN, but I'm considering it again.

All BLVN anime adaptations of N+C censored the gay relationships out, basically altering the whole genre of the story, since romance is an important part in all of them. On top of that the budget and overall quality of the anime was very poor, I wouldn't consider it when deciding whether or not to read the VN.

Imo dmmd has an immersive and original setting, a good pace with reasonable length time-wise, great visuals/music and some of my favorite BLVN love stories. I'd definitely rec it!
 
I can't recall a single good BLVN anime adaptation that was actually decent. They're either incomprehensible (Angel's Feather), have terrible pacing (dmmd and TnC), way too short (Taishou Mebiusline) or all of the above(Sukisho). It goes without saying the animation quality is below average at best and they cut out as much gay content as possible.

I don't count Gakuen Handsome as an actual BLVN because it's a an absurd parody of the genre. But the anime fitted the quality of the source material.

In general visual novel anime adaptations aren't the best, but galge/hentai/eroge and otome have a few decent entries. BLVN adaptations always get the shortnest end of the stick, so I suggest not judging games by the quality of their adaptations.
 
I was super into the first Paradise VN until the actual "romantic" part where everybody becomes a toxic abuser T.T I felt so betrayed
same for me, especially for matsuda because i was so into their relationship...
i wrote reviews of the first 2 games on this thread too, i was very into the survival part but romance wise the game was very bad. I guess the purpose was to make a game where the MC is getting "tortured", but also they tried to make so many elements "romantic" that im not sure what their goal actually was lol especially seeing how they seemed to be unsure of what to do with matsuda
but it was frustrating to be baited with relationships which looked promising (for ex with matsuda and takara ) only for the game to then destroy all that romantic buildup. Im not against relationships turning bad and it can have a surprise effect, but the way it was done was just frustrating and imo they couldve made this in bad ends idk especially since they still wanted to do so called "romantic" good ends.

which routes did you do ?
I read your review with interest, thanks for writing! It's a shame they can't nail a romantic route from start to finish, not even in the third game, although at least some elements improved. I felt like this story had such potential! I was very interested in the surviving part at the start.
thanks for reading!!!!!!!
i would still recommend the 3rd game tho since its way better romance wise. And the h scenes are great so theres that lol. The story is fine too but repetitive
Btw asking everybody, are there good survival VNs you'd recommend?
togainu no chi has some survival elements but they are backgroundish. Id also be interesdted in other survival VNs/BLVNs
 
I can't recall a single good BLVN anime adaptation that was actually decent. They're either incomprehensible (Angel's Feather), have terrible pacing (dmmd and TnC), way too short (Taishou Mebiusline) or all of the above(Sukisho). It goes without saying the animation quality is below average at best and they cut out as much gay content as possible.

I don't count Gakuen Handsome as an actual BLVN because it's a an absurd parody of the genre. But the anime fitted the quality of the source material.

In general visual novel anime adaptations aren't the best, but galge/hentai/eroge and otome have a few decent entries. BLVN adaptations always get the shortnest end of the stick, so I suggest not judging games by the quality of their adaptations.
yeah that's pretty much the sad bl anime adaptation experienceTM. I did enjoy the sukisho anime (it felt really weird though, I agree pacing was all over the place). The 2000s-early 2010s was a weird time when they used to pump out low budget anime/OVA that were pretty just a marketing strategy to get you to play the vn, you don't really see that anymore.

I enjoyed the Gakuen Heaven anime back then(didn't even know it was originally a vn at that time), it was whimsy, fun, and didn't take itself seriously. I liked the cast and the seiyuu did an amazing job, have yet to play the game though~
 
Yae secret route of Suito wa Hakumei was very funny too but I'm still a fan of Hozumi more than the others Li .. Hozumi faces surpassed me. I complete the Visual novel like me a lot. :love:

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But I can't get this CG. If anyone knows, plz tell me. :o_O:

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