any thoughts on yanderes in western otome?

[tsuki_mi]

i've been sitting on this for a while so i'd love to hear if anyone agrees or thinks differently! to preface, i do enjoy playing western otome/amare too -- but i definitely prefer japanese otome far more.

all this to say for the past few years i've noticed a huge uptick in western otome making yandere games -- like a LOT of them -- but i generally don't really vibe with 99% of these entries, or i find them just okay. partially it might just be because i'm expecting a polished, completed game and a lot of these indie games are still in development, but i also think it's because most of these yanderes don't cross as many boundaries as i expect them to. asking for consent is probably the most obvious example i can think of >_<

or when they are hardcore they're more yangire-leaning, which is fine and i enjoy playing those too but i also want to feel like i'm being loved too v_v

i'm not too sure what to think tho and i don't really want to generalize all western otome into one category, so i'm curious if other people have any opinions on the matter!

 

[ninnikuryona]

hmm are there even any western yandere otome worth trying? i feel like the only indie vns created in the west are amare, and im not interested in them ww. got any recs??

 

[woodypei]

I agree with the asking for consent part…since that also doesn't rly seem like a yandere thing. Maybe the guy is just regular obsessive, but that's kinda missing the "yan" part too it.

Luckily I've encountered quite a few Yandere western games where I feel like they do decently hardcore, in comparison to Japanese commercial otome games at least.
although I do agree that a lot of them seem more yangire leaning.

Ones that aren't yangire but def yandere that i liked are:

The kid in the back (nsfw version!!)

College craze (also nsfw and has multiple LIs, one of them is yandere, but I don't know his name cuz of how the plot is)

 

[MooMoon]

A lot of western yandere are not that great it's like they forget what yandere means so when the consent thing pops out it's always weird. I haven't really played enough western yandere, I'm sure there are some good one but most of the time it's not that great. One that does well with the yandere is MiSide although not an otome and doesn't strictly focus on yandere only, it does well with all the tropes. It's a nice horror game.

 

[tsuki_mi]

hmm are there even any western yandere otome worth trying? i feel like the only indie vns created in the west are amare, and im not interested in them ww. got any recs??

i'm the same way haha i prefer japanese otome over indie vns ... but they can be fun to play and being free is a bonus :P i recently enjoyed big bad dogs from itch.io and i like that it specifically discusses the sexism/experience of being a woman in the 2000s but it's also still a wip so be warned</3

I agree with the asking for consent part…since that also doesn't rly seem like a yandere thing. Maybe the guy is just regular obsessive, but that's kinda missing the "yan" part too it.

Luckily I've encountered quite a few Yandere western games where I feel like they do decently hardcore, in comparison to Japanese commercial otome games at least.
although I do agree that a lot of them seem more yangire leaning.

Ones that aren't yangire but def yandere that i liked are:

The kid in the back (nsfw version!!)

College craze (also nsfw and has multiple LIs, one of them is yandere, but I don't know his name cuz of how the plot is)

omg yay i'm not alone!! i think the yanderes i like most end up being in a lot of josei manga where they have free reign to be terrible people haha. idk if we're both thinking of boyfriend to death for western yangire? i enjoyed playing ofc but i like a bit more romance as a personal preference

my roommate really likes the art for the kid at the back but i have mixed opinions about the plot -- but agree 100% it's worth a play and i hope we get to see more nsfw yandere otome :D

i've only played a little bit of college craze and stopped but there's a yandere? tell me more...

A lot of western yandere are not that great it's like they forget what yandere means so when the consent thing pops out it's always weird. I haven't really played enough western yandere, I'm sure there are some good one but most of the time it's not that great. One that does well with the yandere is MiSide although not an otome and doesn't strictly focus on yandere only, it does well with all the tropes. It's a nice horror game.

i've also heard a bit about miside! my prof told me to play it LOL is this a sign?

 

[ninnikuryona]

i'm the same way haha i prefer japanese otome over indie vns ... but they can be fun to play and being free is a bonus :P i recently enjoyed big bad dogs from itch.io and i like that it specifically discusses the sexism/experience of being a woman in the 2000s but it's also still a wip so be warned</3

nice, thank you! though according to comments, it seems like theres a yuri route planned, which makes its otome label somewhat questionable.. nevertheless im happy there are actual games with an actual female protagonist on itchio! doesnt save the game from whining in the comments though ww

 

[tsuki_mi]

nice, thank you! though according to comments, it seems like theres a yuri route planned, which makes its otome label somewhat questionable.. nevertheless im happy there are actual games with an actual female protagonist on itchio! doesnt save the game from whining in the comments though ww

honestly yes i'm surprised there's a female protag on itch.io in general! the entire community has basically shifted entirely to amare which is fine too but i like playing as a girl and having the game actually acknowledge that vs the general gender neutral writing... altho idk if that's too controversial or not lol

but also idk if it's bad that i'm pretty lax about my definition of otome ?! i consider anything with a femc and male love interests otome but now i'm not sure if it's actually defined differently x_x

 

[ninnikuryona]

but also idk if it's bad that i'm pretty lax about my definition of otome ?! i consider anything with a femc and male love interests otome but now i'm not sure if it's actually defined differently x_x

ehhh its a slippery slope im afraid. while there are some commercial otome with yuri routes, theyre usually treated as fanservice*, and are introduced in games with many lis overall. however when your game have three lis and one of them is a woman, can it still be called otome..? hmm. i know im a bit strict with my categorizations, but since we are talking about western side (which has shown it holds very little respect to the otome genre as a whole), i personally cant help but be wary lol. after all, yuri routes in otome are not only fanservice, but also the exception that doesnt make a rule. im not gonna slam you for defining games your own way though, because this discussion may stretch to 15 days and 15 nights lol

*thats not to say i dont like yuri or something! i just feel like if you want to get your girls love fill, you should support actual yuri instead of asking for a gxg route in a gxb genre. does it make sense?...............

 

[tsuki_mi]

ehhh its a slippery slope im afraid. while there are some commercial otome with yuri routes, theyre usually treated as fanservice*, and are introduced in games with many lis overall. however when your game have three lis and one of them is a woman, can it still be called otome..? hmm. i know im a bit strict with my categorizations, but since we are talking about western side (which has shown it holds very little respect to the otome genre as a whole), i personally cant help but be wary lol. after all, yuri routes in otome are not only fanservice, but also the exception that doesnt make a rule. im not gonna slam you for defining games your own way though, because this discussion may stretch to 15 days and 15 nights lol

*thats not to say i dont like yuri or something! i just feel like if you want to get your girls love fill, you should support actual yuri instead of asking for a gxg route in a gxb genre. does it make sense?...............

nono thank you for sharing + letting me know! i want to know more about what other people think since none of my friends play actual otome/non-western games so i'd like to connect more w the community. and i def agree it can be pretty misleading ... i also am wary of western devs because of how the genre gets trivialized and made fun of :/

i do like yuri too but i totally agree with you -- actually you made me think of this recent amare game that went on kickstarter and had a male and female mc; the male mc got 3 male love interests and the female mc got 2 male and 1 female. even setting aside the fact that people who came for otome aspects will only get two routes... if it's supposedly fair, why wouldn't the male mc have a bxg route then?

i just realized that was such a tangent omg sorry ....!!

 

[ninnikuryona]

you're fine dont worry!:D

i do like yuri too but i totally agree with you -- actually you made me think of this recent amare game that went on kickstarter and had a male and female mc; the male mc got 3 male love interests and the female mc got 2 male and 1 female. even setting aside the fact that people who came for otome aspects will only get two routes... if it's supposedly fair, why wouldn't the male mc have a bxg route then?

ohhhh i think i heard about this one! i already forgot the name lol, but i discussed it with another user literally a couple of days ago. what we both got curious about is how much more interesting and, i dont know, "unique"(?) male mc's love interests looked, compared to female mc. it almost sends a message that pretty/handsome/cute men cant actually be straight/love women (a topic ever present on twitter, especially concerning virche), which is extremely funny to think about LOLOL, but also why would you even need to differentiate between the two mcs instead of just.. doing what other amare games do and make all lis accessible to every mc? is it just to avoid the bxg ship, because the average consumer thinks of bishoujoge/galge (romance games with male protagonist and female love interests) as nothing but fuel for degenerate incels to live out their fantasies? (conspiracy)

but then again, im not a fan of the genre to begin with, so i dont think i have a right to discuss it. i mean i did play several amare in the past, but nowadays i would rather play either a full-blown bl or an actual otome, instead of settling for neither. if anything, im currently way more interested in amare with strictly female love interests, like how to date an entity (and stay alive). but unfortunately its extremely underrepresented in the amare scene, so i cant even think of another example of a game with choosable mc/pronouns and female lis only:(

 

[dogiwall]

haven't played that much western indie otome and amare vns ever since i write my own stories because most of them don't have writing that appeals much to me. not even that much of a fan of the amare genre out of the petty reason of finding the FAQs from the amaregames website super pretentious. would rather learn japanese at some point so i can play novelgame vns instead lol.

and regarding most western "yanderes" not being extreme enough: certain kinds of people from the western hemisphere have massive fits about diabolik lovers and other vns that don't have 100% pure romance. and even other media given batoto comments towards yandere webtoons and manga. pretty sure most of them avoid writing yanderes at the worse level either because they want to avoid backlash or they just want to write a lightly possessive dude that they think is a yandere.

 

[tsuki_mi]

you're fine dont worry!:D

ohhhh i think i heard about this one! i already forgot the name lol, but i discussed it with another user literally a couple of days ago. what we both got curious about is how much more interesting and, i dont know, "unique"(?) male mc's love interests looked, compared to female mc. it almost sends a message that pretty/handsome/cute men cant actually be straight/love women (a topic ever present on twitter, especially concerning virche), which is extremely funny to think about LOLOL, but also why would you even need to differentiate between the two mcs instead of just.. doing what other amare games do and make all lis accessible to every mc? is it just to avoid the bxg ship, because the average consumer thinks of bishoujoge/galge (romance games with male protagonist and female love interests) as nothing but fuel for degenerate incels to live out their fantasies? (conspiracy)

but then again, im not a fan of the genre to begin with, so i dont think i have a right to discuss it. i mean i did play several amare in the past, but nowadays i would rather play either a full-blown bl or an actual otome, instead of settling for neither. if anything, im currently way more interested in amare with strictly female love interests, like how to date an entity (and stay alive). but unfortunately its extremely underrepresented in the amare scene, so i cant even think of another example of a game with choosable mc/pronouns and female lis only:(

wait omg yes that one!! i had the exact same complaint!! all of the male mc's love interests looked so much more interesting i was really jealous... the differentiation also makes no sense me because wouldn't it be much better for fans to be able to pursue all the routes freely? there are ofc some people who will do both routes regardless but i'm someone who only wants to play as a girl if i have the option... i mean for that reason i haven't played any galge besides fate/hollow ataraxia but since i don't know much abt them anyways i'll buy into your conspiracy 100%!

and wait whattt people are saying that about virche? virche the otome game?? the game where you date a bunch of guys as a woman?

ehh i don't think u have to be a fan to critique the genre! i play a fair amount of them bc every romance game from the indie vn community is amare now, but i always come back to japanese otome for a reason :P and now that you mention it i can't name a single amare with only female love interests... wait that's actually so crazy. oh but thank u for the recommendation! i'll def play it :D

 

[tsuki_mi]

haven't played that much western indie otome and amare vns ever since i write my own stories because most of them don't have writing that appeals much to me. not even that much of a fan of the amare genre out of the petty reason of finding the FAQs from the amaregames website super pretentious. would rather learn japanese at some point so i can play novelgame vns instead lol.

and regarding most western "yanderes" not being extreme enough: certain kinds of people from the western hemisphere have massive fits about diabolik lovers and other vns that don't have 100% pure romance. and even other media given batoto comments towards yandere webtoons and manga. pretty sure most of them avoid writing yanderes at the worse level either because they want to avoid backlash or they just want to write a lightly possessive dude that they think is a yandere.

i went to go read the FAQ after you mentioned it and i don't like it eitherrr omfg it's basically implying BL and otome are shallow even if not intentionally... also idk if i'm being too woke but i get the sense the people who coined the term amare are japanese either so likee ... but that's a whole nother can of worms

and omg nooo i think you might be right :( you reminded me of all the recent love in deepspace controversy going on lol idk if you're familiar with that backlash but western fans don't tend to tolerate much i think? but it's def disappointing to go play a yandere game and not really get what i'm specifically looking for from that kind of content.

also i hope that you're enjoying writing your own stories!!

 

[ninnikuryona]

and wait whattt people are saying that about virche? virche the otome game?? the game where you date a bunch of guys as a woman?

yup! unfortunately i dont think i can provide examples since its been months, but i can think of two separate times when virche went viral on twitter, one is with mathis, the other with ankou

with mathis, someone posted a cg with him lying in bed and being all cute and pretty. because it went viral, it attracted a crowd of fujoshi who were shocked and disgusted to learn he was from a "straight" game, saying like "eh he wouldve worked well in a yaoi" or "i hope mc pegs him at least??" which is just.. no? stop?

and with ankou, some girl called him gay, and when other pointed out that he is straight and is in love with the heroine, she went on this insane ramble about otome genre as a whole, calling it shitty and saying "you expect me to believe a pretty man like him is straight?? no way in hell lol", which just plays into conservative stereotypes about gay men. i found the screenshot lol here it is

 

[ninnikuryona]

and with ankou, some girl called him gay,

nvm i remembered it wrong sorry lol, she responded to a tweet with ankou completely unprompted but then went to argue with some users who pointed out how horrific she sounds. just an average day on otometwt

 

[usagi-k]

i agree with the sentiment of them not hitting as hard honestly i think for me it's mostly a personality thing? ive played a decent amount of amares and otomes on itch when i was obsessed with consuming any and every yandere content i could find but i find that most of the yandere lis almost always have the same kind of motivations surrounding obsession and stalking and there's no actual variety or depth in their actions. obviously im not expecting something unrealistic with how most games on itch are free or demos leading up to a big passion project but i think the lack of variety or i guess lack of having actually risky or unnerving lis is what hasnt really drawn my attention towards any western otome or amare (specifically for yanderes) it all feels very cookie cutter or standard to me

on a positive note one game that i did like and think about is called perfect love on itch ^^ its an amare where you can kind of groom the only one li into your ideal type of yandere based on the actions you push them towards (such as focusing on them growing to become violent or instead manipulative in nature) which i found to be extremely fascinating and fun :D the artstyle might not be the most appealing in anyway but i did like the concept alot

nvm i remembered it wrong sorry lol, she responded to a tweet with ankou completely unprompted but then went to argue with some users who pointed out how horrific she sounds. just an average day on otometwt

oh my god i remember this fiasco since lots of people were commenting on it TT in general i think because lots of new people have become exposed to otoges recently there have been so many useless arguments and discourse going around TT started even moreso by people who have beef with the genre with no apparent reason lmao

 

[ninnikuryona]

oh my god i remember this fiasco since lots of people were commenting on it TT in general i think because lots of new people have become exposed to otoges recently there have been so many useless arguments and discourse going around TT started even moreso by people who have beef with the genre with no apparent reason lmao

its a combination of everything straight + catered to women. they hate the fact that women have the entire genre for them, and a genre filled with beautiful men at that, which is why theyre now fighting tooth and nail for absurd demands like lixli yaoi, male protagonist or gender-neutral mc overall. im glad they get rightfully dogpiled every time they start acting up, but i wish they just stopped talking about otome overall since they hate the genre so much lol

 

[tsuki_mi]

yup! unfortunately i dont think i can provide examples since its been months, but i can think of two separate times when virche went viral on twitter, one is with mathis, the other with ankou

with mathis, someone posted a cg with him lying in bed and being all cute and pretty. because it went viral, it attracted a crowd of fujoshi who were shocked and disgusted to learn he was from a "straight" game, saying like "eh he wouldve worked well in a yaoi" or "i hope mc pegs him at least??" which is just.. no? stop?

and with ankou, some girl called him gay, and when other pointed out that he is straight and is in love with the heroine, she went on this insane ramble about otome genre as a whole, calling it shitty and saying "you expect me to believe a pretty man like him is straight?? no way in hell lol", which just plays into conservative stereotypes about gay men. i found the screenshot lol here it isView attachment 96635

DAMNNN.... virche is my most recently completed otome (hence the pfp) so i'm like extra attached to it rn aghhhhh twitter leave the virche lis alone...!! leave mathis and ankou alone!! but honestly when you show me the examples i think i'm not surprised i've seen this kind of language everywhere... i get rlly annoyed when people hate on straight couples or straight ships the same way i would if someone made fun of slash ships it's just so annoying & i'm sorry u end up seeing all that </3

i agree with the sentiment of them not hitting as hard honestly i think for me it's mostly a personality thing? ive played a decent amount of amares and otomes on itch when i was obsessed with consuming any and every yandere content i could find but i find that most of the yandere lis almost always have the same kind of motivations surrounding obsession and stalking and there's no actual variety or depth in their actions. obviously im not expecting something unrealistic with how most games on itch are free or demos leading up to a big passion project but i think the lack of variety or i guess lack of having actually risky or unnerving lis is what hasnt really drawn my attention towards any western otome or amare (specifically for yanderes) it all feels very cookie cutter or standard to me

on a positive note one game that i did like and think about is called perfect love on itch ^^ its an amare where you can kind of groom the only one li into your ideal type of yandere based on the actions you push them towards (such as focusing on them growing to become violent or instead manipulative in nature) which i found to be extremely fascinating and fun :D the artstyle might not be the most appealing in anyway but i did like the concept alot

super 100% agree! i always feel like there's not any good reason/imperative for the yandere to like the mc which is really important to sell the believability of why they're yandere for mc in the first place. either it's pretty vague about the reason or it's something where i think ... well, that could have been anyone, right? which is quite unflattering lol but i digress -- thank u so much for sharing!!

i also have played perfect love!! i really enjoyed the concept as well which i thought was very interesting, but it did end up feeling pretty formulaic for me since the endings were basically perfectly split based off the choices lol it was very ... symmetrical? if that's the right word to describe it. now if someone could do something like our life: beginnings and always but with a yandere, i think i'd be quite satisfied :P

its a combination of everything straight + catered to women. they hate the fact that women have the entire genre for them, and a genre filled with beautiful men at that, which is why theyre now fighting tooth and nail for absurd demands like lixli yaoi, male protagonist or gender-neutral mc overall. im glad they get rightfully dogpiled every time they start acting up, but i wish they just stopped talking about otome overall since they hate the genre so much lol

yeah i agree :( i feel like fandom and fan spaces are filled with much more people who aren't really fans or don't engage in fandom with actual respect for the media. also it's already so rare to have games for women in general so idk why they're fighting so hard to push otoge away from being women-centric

 

[ninnikuryona]

yeah i agree :( i feel like fandom and fan spaces are filled with much more people who aren't really fans or don't engage in fandom with actual respect for the media. also it's already so rare to have games for women in general so idk why they're fighting so hard to push otoge away from being women-centric

it gets extra nasty when you remember why the genre came to existence in the first place. erikawa keiko, seeing that theres literally no space for women in the gaming world, went and established an all-women development team, which resulted in angelique being released. this is a beautiful and extremely important piece of history! but now these people are trying to.. add everyone else to the mix....??? because women are too entitled and they dont deserve to have their own space???.....??...?
im sorry the discussion derailed so much from your initial question;;;; its a topic im a little passionate about so i tend to yap;;;;;

 

[tsuki_mi]

it gets extra nasty when you remember why the genre came to existence in the first place. erikawa keiko, seeing that theres literally no space for women in the gaming world, went and established an all-women development team, which resulted in angelique being released. this is a beautiful and extremely important piece of history! but now these people are trying to.. add everyone else to the mix....??? because women are too entitled and they dont deserve to have their own space???.....??...?
im sorry the discussion derailed so much from your initial question;;;; its a topic im a little passionate about so i tend to yap;;;;;

wait don't be sorry i love the subject too!! the original questions is just a suggestion anyways i'm not pressed about it derailing hehe unless that's against the rules?!

and thank u for sharing that fact with me! i need to do more research into the history of otoge as well, but that really is such a wonderful piece of history -- it really reminds me of fanfiction too and how it began through women and star trek if i'm not mistaken.

...i'm about to derail the convo even further by bringing up reader insert fanfiction but i feel like it fits so well haha because it used to be a very female dominated "genre" but i've seen more than a few writers nowadays complaining about how it's all female pov and now male readers feel alienated. i can see why'd they'd say that but also the reason it's female dominated is because women are writing them? if the lack of non-female povs is an issue people can write their own, but i don't really see the point of complaining about walking into a space that has historically always been by women for women and -- surprise -- finding women there

 

[ninnikuryona]

...i'm about to derail the convo even further by bringing up reader insert fanfiction but i feel like it fits so well haha because it used to be a very female dominated "genre" but i've seen more than a few writers nowadays complaining about how it's all female pov and now male readers feel alienated. i can see why'd they'd say that but also the reason it's female dominated is because women are writing them? if the lack of non-female povs is an issue people can write their own, but i don't really see the point of complaining about walking into a space that has historically always been by women for women and -- surprise -- finding women there

wait yeah this is so true like.. this is ALWAYS the case. people love bringing up how men "feel alienated" or stuff (which is extra funny because with otome specifically target audience does NOT mean no one else can play a game. hell i myself play a shitton of bishoujoge and im not even a man) but then.. the ones who get nagged about it.. are women...?? even though men should be able to write fanfics just as much as women do?? or are they saying that women are supposed to work for both themselves and men????? would men do the same for women? somehow i really doubt it!

and this is also funny and somewhat related, but i love playing girls' frontline (mobile gacha game about gijinka/anthropomorphized guns), which has a gender-neutral mc (you can choose your gender) but an overwhelmingly male fanbase (because waifu). when i was looking up fanfictions, the only ones i could find were all malepov. should i complain about that as well lmao???? of course not, that would be a huge entitlement!! so i just went and wrote my own fanfiction, even created my own oc (though i dont understand the first thing about guns so she kinda sucks haha), even with my extremely limited skills in writing. and i had a blast to be honest!

i really think that if you do want something, you should either seek it out, because theres a huge chance it already exists and BEGS for your support, or create it yourself. no matter how low your skills are, if you keep practicing, you will one day create something very beautiful! AND you will also satisfy a demand on the market if you decide to share it publicly! but no, apparently the correct choice is to harass already established authors and genres because...... just because????

 

[happypenguin32]

super 100% agree! i always feel like there's not any good reason/imperative for the yandere to like the mc which is really important to sell the believability of why they're yandere for mc in the first place. either it's pretty vague about the reason or it's something where i think ... well, that could have been anyone, right? which is quite unflattering lol but i digress -- thank u so much for sharing!!

You put my thoughts into words perfectly!

For me, most yandere characters (at least the ones on itch.io) tend to feel pretty formulaic. I think that authors get too caught up in the "yandere = likes MC" mindset that they forget they need to make the yandere an actual character. Like liking the MC can't be their only trait, if you know what I mean. As a result, most yanderes are just caricatures of each other. Not necessarily the author's fault since they're most likely a solo developer who neither has time nor budget but unfortunately, the story suffers :/

...i'm about to derail the convo even further by bringing up reader insert fanfiction but i feel like it fits so well haha because it used to be a very female dominated "genre" but i've seen more than a few writers nowadays complaining about how it's all female pov and now male readers feel alienated. i can see why'd they'd say that but also the reason it's female dominated is because women are writing them? if the lack of non-female povs is an issue people can write their own, but i don't really see the point of complaining about walking into a space that has historically always been by women for women and -- surprise -- finding women there

I feel this lol. I'm pretty active in the interactive fiction space, and it's mind-boggling and frustrating how quickly people dismiss female-genderlocked stories as "just smut" or something along those lines. Particularly crazy because in most interactive fiction, you can choose your gender (so just don't read the female-genderlocked ones if you don't want to?), and the male-genderlocked ones don't seem to get as much hate.

 

[tsuki_mi]

wait yeah this is so true like.. this is ALWAYS the case. people love bringing up how men "feel alienated" or stuff (which is extra funny because with otome specifically target audience does NOT mean no one else can play a game. hell i myself play a shitton of bishoujoge and im not even a man) but then.. the ones who get nagged about it.. are women...?? even though men should be able to write fanfics just as much as women do?? or are they saying that women are supposed to work for both themselves and men????? would men do the same for women? somehow i really doubt it!

and this is also funny and somewhat related, but i love playing girls' frontline (mobile gacha game about gijinka/anthropomorphized guns), which has a gender-neutral mc (you can choose your gender) but an overwhelmingly male fanbase (because waifu). when i was looking up fanfictions, the only ones i could find were all malepov. should i complain about that as well lmao???? of course not, that would be a huge entitlement!! so i just went and wrote my own fanfiction, even created my own oc (though i dont understand the first thing about guns so she kinda sucks haha), even with my extremely limited skills in writing. and i had a blast to be honest!

i really think that if you do want something, you should either seek it out, because theres a huge chance it already exists and BEGS for your support, or create it yourself. no matter how low your skills are, if you keep practicing, you will one day create something very beautiful! AND you will also satisfy a demand on the market if you decide to share it publicly! but no, apparently the correct choice is to harass already established authors and genres because...... just because????

right?!?! ok so glad it's not just me cuz i was worried i'd come across as a big ol complainer but like you really just do not see women complaining in the droves that men do about feeling left out. so many of the popular games across all genres are male protag and everyone plays those just fine, but the moment it's a female protag -- esp if not a conventionally attractive one -- and then i see men complaining abt it's unrelatable or unrealistic or that they're not interested. and you're so right like even if they complain is it to tell women writers to write something they're not interested in when they're doing it for free?

oooh yes i don't play gfl myself but i can def emphasize and relate to that. and i'm sure your oc is wonderful just for existing! but see you literally did it yourself you went out and made the content you wanted to see ... i agree that most of the complaints abt not seeing what people want to see can be fixed if they just pick up a pen and got to work! i also write fanfic too hehe and i like making it as self-indulgent as possible bc i'm writing what i like and people can choose to like it if they want but i'm at least putting out there what i want to see :D

For me, most yandere characters (at least the ones on itch.io) tend to feel pretty formulaic. I think that authors get too caught up in the "yandere = likes MC" mindset that they forget they need to make the yandere an actual character. Like liking the MC can't be their only trait, if you know what I mean. As a result, most yanderes are just caricatures of each other. Not necessarily the author's fault since they're most likely a solo developer who neither has time nor budget but unfortunately, the story suffers :/

yes yes yes!! a yandere without any actual draw to them just ends up boring me, esp since a lot of them follow the same almost-haraguro-but-not-really archetype ... if that makes sense and if i'm not totally making that up lol. but i agree i think a lot of indie vn devs are familiar with one another's works and then that just ends up creating a feedback loop. aren't there like 3 different clown/jester themed yandere amaru games going around??

i def agree with the amount of effort however which we should acknowledge -- but i also develop games too and i do try to keep a minimum level of thoughtfulness and quality, so hopefully i'm not falling into the same trap i complain about lol

I feel this lol. I'm pretty active in the interactive fiction space, and it's mind-boggling and frustrating how quickly people dismiss female-genderlocked stories as "just smut" or something along those lines. Particularly crazy because in most interactive fiction, you can choose your gender (so just don't read the female-genderlocked ones if you don't want to?), and the male-genderlocked ones don't seem to get as much hate.

oh my gosh me too!! idk if i'm going out on a limb to say you might dabble in choicescript if too, but i see a lot of division there. i really like a wip called scapegoated which is female-genderlocked, and i always see people asking why it has to be genderlocked ... versus barely anyone asking why the extremely popular infinity series is male-genderlocked. which btw i think is totally up to the author to decide what kind of story they want to tell! but it's telling that people always complain about femlocked games and not malelocked ones -_-

i think a minor peeve i have with if now that we're on the subject is that sometimes you can just ... kind of tell when they're written w a specific gender in mind? although i guess i'm the problem bc i didn't mind it in wayhaven but i did in poma ... oopsies

 

[ninnikuryona]

right?!?! ok so glad it's not just me cuz i was worried i'd come across as a big ol complainer but like you really just do not see women complaining in the droves that men do about feeling left out. so many of the popular games across all genres are male protag and everyone plays those just fine, but the moment it's a female protag -- esp if not a conventionally attractive one -- and then i see men complaining abt it's unrelatable or unrealistic or that they're not interested.

the person i discussed a similar point with said it perfectly: men have no issue with relating to a literal pink blob (kirby), but as soon as the protagonist is a woman, especially non-sexualized, they suddenly cannot even comprehend the thought of relating to her? genuinely make it make sense!
same with stuff like re9. men were whining about how this game is too femgazey, when this is one of the very very VERY few examples of a game with an actually attractive/appealing to women male character that hit the mainstream. like, when a woman expresses her discomfort with a sexualized female character, men tell her to shut up and go create her own sexy male characters, but when women do actually create sexy male characters (leon was discussed a lot with female designers after all), they suddenly feel personally attacked? thats so weak of them ww

i hope you have fun with your ficwriting journey:):) the beauty of creating is precisely that you can bend reality to your own will (read "write selfinserts without a since shred of guilt LOL)

 

[mizumachi]

i love yanderes but i have to definitely agree, i think western ones are very lacking, and i think it's because western vns either are too focused on making sure it's not as "problematic" (i've seen people talk about green flag yanderes and platonic yanderes which is. LMAOOOO) or they veer into a comically flanderised version of the trope.

also i think in general, western vns lack the build up needed for this trope to really work, since in my experience alot of them tend to be really short. which can work! folie fatale is on the shorter side and is beloved, but that's because it actually does things other than "man loves mc so much he kills people" when it comes to its yandere character

imo the appeal of yanderes is not the whole "i'll kill for you" aspect but moreso the fall into the "yan" of it. western yandere characters are just like that from the get go, but i want build up... i want to see them GET worse, not just be worser