I request a tag for joseimuke + amare games

[BLFan]

I realized that some games aren't properly categorized.. they're not Otome or BL games are bromance. If possible, could admin add that tag so those games don't end up in the miscellaneous forum?

Edit: amare tag it's a good idea for to complement games that feature both male and female main characters in the same game with romantic interests in both sex.

 

[Beannie]

It would be cool to have such a tag. Although I was wondering how to make it as clear as possible, so that uploaders use the BL or Otome tag, and Joseimuke for media that does not fit either

 

[ninnikuryona]

true.. theres a dire need for the amare tag too!

 

[tsuii.]

sorry for being ignorant, could you give an example of joseimuke and amare?

 

[ninnikuryona]

sorry for being ignorant, could you give an example of joseimuke and amare?

joseimuke — a game/project aimed at female audience, not necessarily has romance or female protagonist. joseimuke games/projects: ensemble stars (male idols, mc is a girl but theres no romance), helios rising heroes (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), touken ranbu (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), hypnosis mic (no mc, most characters are male), stand my heroes/break my case (female mc but no dedicated routes, all playable characters are male)

amare — a romance game that features love interests of various sex and/or a protagonist with choosable sex. games like trapped with jester, how to date an entity (and stay alive), killer chat, 14 days with you, blooming panic, our life and many others
for comparison, otome — a romance game with female mc and male love interests

 

[tsuii.]

joseimuke — a game/project aimed at female audience, not necessarily has romance or female protagonist. joseimuke games/projects: ensemble stars (male idols, mc is a girl but theres no romance), helios rising heroes (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), touken ranbu (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), hypnosis mic (no mc, most characters are male), stand my heroes/break my case (female mc but no dedicated routes, all playable characters are male)

amare — a romance game that features love interests of various sex and/or a protagonist with choosable sex. games like trapped with jester, how to date an entity (and stay alive), killer chat, 14 days with you, blooming panic, our life and many others
for comparison, otome — a romance game with female mc and male love interests

Ohh! Perfect examples, I get it now, thank you!
+1 to add those tags then!

 

[Qundy]

Funny I'm seeing this topic here cuz there was a similar discussion about game tags just a few days ago on the otome subreddit. That one got locked within 24 hours

joseimuke — a game/project aimed at female audience, not necessarily has romance or female protagonist. joseimuke games/projects: ensemble stars (male idols, mc is a girl but theres no romance), helios rising heroes (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), touken ranbu (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), hypnosis mic (no mc, most characters are male), stand my heroes/break my case (female mc but no dedicated routes, all playable characters are male)

amare — a romance game that features love interests of various sex and/or a protagonist with choosable sex. games like trapped with jester, how to date an entity (and stay alive), killer chat, 14 days with you, blooming panic, our life and many others
for comparison, otome — a romance game with female mc and male love interests

I'm curious how will such a system be implemented?
Like all the games listed in amare above have amare, otome, some even have gay (the equivalent on our forum is BL) tags by the devs themselves.
Except 14 days - which only has amare, how to date an entity - which dgaf and only put dating sim

If we throw joseimuke into the mix, and because joseimuke and amare are the bigger categories, we might get a game that has joseimuke, amare, bl, otome all at once LOL. Currently we already have games that have both otome/BL prefixes.

Traditionally speaking, in the country of origin (Japan) the genres rarely merge like that. Should a game get multiple tags when uploaded here if joseimuke or amare were to be added?
we could just let ppl tag whatever they want, it'd be much easier for the mods since they wouldn't have to moderate everything, but I don't know how that'd turn out in the long run.

 

[ninnikuryona]

I'm curious how will such a system be implemented?
Like all the games listed in amare above have amare, otome, some even have gay (the equivalent on our forum is BL) tags by the devs themselves.
Except 14 days - which only has amare, how to date an entity - which dgaf and only put dating sim

if a game only has female mc and male lis, its otome. if a game has mc with choosable pronouns and/or lis of various sexes, its amare. no need to place the "otome" or "bl" tags on them, because theyre neither otome nor bl. amare is a relatively new tag, which is why its not exactly popular, but its a tag that has to be made, since people love tagging everything under the sun as otome and muddying the waters

 

[ninnikuryona]

Traditionally speaking, in the country of origin (Japan) the genres rarely merge like that.

this is false! japanese people are actually extremely thorough with their tagging system. i mean, ever since january theres a huge conflict regarding garumani original (otome) circle on dlsite, which, despite claiming their works as otome, keeps adding more and more bl stuff in their audios, which obviously upsets people. japanese people only have one condition: dont mix the genres. if you call yourself an otome, do NOT add bl (like virche did for example), and, likewise, if you call yourself a bl, do NOT add gxb stuff. and dont use your characters you created for one genre in another genre. this stuff will please no one

 

[Qundy]

this is false! japanese people are actually extremely thorough with their tagging system. i mean, ever since january theres a huge conflict regarding garumani original (otome) circle on dlsite, which, despite claiming their works as otome, keeps adding more and more bl stuff in their audios, which obviously upsets people. japanese people only have one condition: dont mix the genres. if you call yourself an otome, do NOT add bl (like virche did for example), and, likewise, if you call yourself a bl, do NOT add gxb stuff. and dont use your characters you created for one genre in another genre. this stuff will please no one

... I don't understand how what I said was false?
青春はじめました！and Saint Beast ~螺旋の章~ are two examples of mixed genres I know. Perhaps I should've said "extremely rarely"...?
BL and otome co-exist in Saint beast. Tho it's probably too niche to find any opinions about it....

青春はじめました！is a different case but also mixed genres. Half the game is about playing as a guy and dating girls. I searched around just now and Japanese fans in reviews as well as reseller sites have no problem calling it 乙女.
Honeybee themselves allude to the otome genre by saying
"プレイヤーの視点を選べる事で、通常の乙女ゲームの女の子目線では分からない男の子側の気持ちを描いたり、"
source: https://www.honeybee-cd.com/seisyun/system/w_hero.html
That's as clear as it gets when it comes to calling a game 乙女ゲーム. in fact it gives me not like other otome vibes lmao
Your explanation seems more about products being sneaky, thus making it a "bad unavoidable surprise".

...and holy freaking God quoting your post reveals the spoiler part in the reply editor. Now I wish I could go back to the 10 minutes ago before reading that. Unexpected forum functional hazard ://

 

[ninnikuryona]

...and holy freaking God quoting your post reveals the spoiler part in the reply editor. Now I wish I could go back to the 10 minutes ago before reading that. Unexpected forum functional hazard ://

sorry for the spoiler ww!!
either way, genres should not be mixed. there are some hybrids sure, but both games that you provided as examples do have their own protagonists. also, saint beast is not tagged as otome officially as far as i can tell, which checks out.
as for seishun hajimemashita, i guess they tagged their game as otome because its part of their otome series? and considering how choosing a female mc locks you onto male lis and choosing a male mc locks you onto female lis, it just sounds like a normal otome-galge hybrid. so, not otome ultimately

 

[blackflag]

Games that wr joseimuke can just be submitted with MISC.

For now I don't think we want tag bloat until the new version of the website is up.

 

[Anasfu]

this is false! japanese people are actually extremely thorough with their tagging system. i mean, ever since january theres a huge conflict regarding garumani original (otome) circle on dlsite, which, despite claiming their works as otome, keeps adding more and more bl stuff in their audios, which obviously upsets people. japanese people only have one condition: dont mix the genres. if you call yourself an otome, do NOT add bl (like virche did for example), and, likewise, if you call yourself a bl, do NOT add gxb stuff. and dont use your characters you created for one genre in another genre. this stuff will please no one

It seems to me the example here is false. What you've hidden under the spoiler doesn't even include a BL option for the main character or her love interest; the gay character was a secondary character who was in love with the MC's LI and failed to become a romantic partner from the start. I saw comments in Japanese when I tried googling otome game research papers, and they were all homophobic and misogynistic, a 'don't stand out' attitude rather than a desire for clear categorization between otome/other games

 

[ninnikuryona]

What you've hidden under the spoiler doesn't even include a BL option for the main character or her love interest; the gay character was a secondary character who was in love with the MC's LI and failed to become a romantic partner from the start.

yes i know i know! i provided it as an example of mixing genres. obviously those who go to otome want to read otome, not some halfbaked bl? the audience was obviously hurt, especially considering how it was never mentioned ANYWHERE and only got known once people actually purchased the game with their own money, and they still remember the incident to this day. and, once again, considering whats happening to grmn right now, its more important than ever to establish proper zones for genres!

 

[Anasfu]

yes i know i know! i provided it as an example of mixing genres. obviously those who go to otome want to read otome, not some halfbaked bl? the audience was obviously hurt, especially considering how it was never mentioned ANYWHERE and only got known once people actually purchased the game with their own money, and they still remember the incident to this day. and, once again, considering whats happening to grmn right now, its more important than ever to establish proper zones for genres!

Does the game become a BL/GL when the father/mother of an MC/LI is LGBT+? Why does it need to be marked with a tag when it is not quite about major characters' orientations?

 

[ninnikuryona]

Does the game become a BL/GL when the father/mother of an MC/LI is LGBT+? Why does it need to be marked with a tag when it is not quite about major characters' orientations?

but this kinda DID involve a major character. he was the poster boy, after all! also, background characters dont really matter, right? since theyre background characters. however, if it has to do with main characters, like in this case, then yes, it absolutely must be stated beforehand so that people know what theyre buying. or, ideally, not added at all (once again, background characters are fine). you cant just add stuff not related to the genre out of the blue without notifying anyone and still expect people to give you money

 

[Anasfu]

but this kinda DID involve a major character. he was the poster boy, after all! also, background characters dont really matter, right? since theyre background characters. however, if it has to do with main characters, like in this case, then yes, it absolutely must be stated beforehand so that people know what theyre buying. or, ideally, not added at all (once again, background characters are fine). you cant just add stuff not related to the genre out of the blue without notifying anyone and still expect people to give you money

Doesn't it bother you that your line about the 'poster boy' makes it sound like the character is tainted by someone else's sexuality? The 'poster boy' never reciprocated the other person's feelings and didn't know about them at all. Any joseimuke game could just as easily be labeled as an otome because it has characters in love in the background, and these characters can be minor or more important; it's hilarious to see this kind of argumentation about LGBT+ only

 

[ninnikuryona]

Doesn't it bother you that your line about the 'poster boy' makes it sound like the character is tainted by someone else's sexuality? The 'poster boy' never reciprocated the other person's feelings and didn't know about them at all. Any joseimuke game could just as easily be labeled as an otome because it has characters in love in the background; it's hilarious to see this kind of argumentation about LGBT+ only

not really? when people bought the game, they expected the heroine x li romance, not heroine x li x side chara love triangle, no matter if it was reciprocated or not. this still boils down to people getting something they didnt pay for. still though, the game is indeed otome, just with some unpleasant surprises
and no, joseimuke with romantic fanservice sprinkled here and there is not otome, because for them to be otome, they have to have proper routes with proper relationship development between heroine and characters. hypmic doesnt even have an mc, but its still joseimuke, because, well, hot guys. same with tsukipro. background characters dont matter at all!! after all, bl games fall under the joseimuke umbrella as well. however, since they have their own label (bl), not every single bl game has to also have a joseimuke tag

 

[Anasfu]

not really? when people bought the game, they expected the heroine x li romance, not heroine x li x side chara love triangle, no matter if it was reciprocated or not. this still boils down to people getting something they didnt pay for. still though, the game is indeed otome, just with some unpleasant surprises
and no, joseimuke with romantic fanservice sprinkled here and there is not otome, because for them to be otome, they have to have proper routes with proper relationship development between heroine and characters. hypmic doesnt even have an mc, but its still joseimuke, because, well, hot guys. same with tsukipro. background characters dont matter at all!! after all, bl games fall under the joseimuke umbrella as well. however, since they have their own label (bl), not every single bl game has to also have a joseimuke tag

I'm not convinced at all; this argumentation works only in case the gay option is perceived as socially inferior and potentially dangerous to the characters' 'normal' sexuality, and that is homophobic. Self-identified yumejoshi girls (it doesn't mean all of them, but those who are the focus in particular topics), who are the main critics of Virshe and Co, are homophobic activists who do not play BL/GL for ideological reasons, and it's visible when you read their threads and articles full of conspiracy theories about birth rate, for example

 

[ninnikuryona]

I'm not convinced at all; this argumentation works only in case the gay option is perceived as socially inferior and potentially dangerous to the characters' 'normal' sexuality, and that is homophobic. Self-identified yumejoshi girls (it doesn't mean all of them, but those who are the focus in particular topics), who are the main critics of Virshe and Co, are homophobic activists who do not play BL/GL for ideological reasons, and it's visible when you read their threads and articles full of conspiracy theories about birth rate, for example

i disagree with you heavily on this. the sexuality is not even the topic of this discussion. huge number of yumejoshi are also fujoshi. i am one myself! (not fujoshi, but i read yaoi) moreover, im bisexual, i love yuri, and i read just about everything. however, once again, the discussion is not about homophobia or not, sexuality or not, but proper zoning, tagging and warnings. you dont buy yuri to get gxb action. you dont buy yaoi for bxg action. you dont buy bishoujoge for bxb action. so why is otome different? you can clearly define yuri, yaoi and bishoujoge, but why is otome always the "everchanging" genre?
saying that otome is about female mcs and male lis being romantic strictly with each other is not homophobic, thats just repeating the definition of the genre. criticizing a writer for pulling stuff out of nowhere when it wasnt communicated beforehand is not homophobic either

anyway, i feel like we have gone off-topic. if you wish to continue the discussion, lets take it to dms perhaps? or lets just stop spamming

 

[BLFan]

true.. theres a dire need for the amare tag too!

+1 good idea also

 

[Kyouri]

I always just figured if it has both BL and Otome tag then it probably is amare or similar lol.

 

[BLFan]

@blackflag I have some gacha game videos recorded.. it's possible the admin will add the gameplay tag to the otome section as well.

 

[woodypei]

I recommend making this request on the "Suggestions" part of Site Support.
Previously when I had a similar request for some category stuff, I was told to post here by Admin and mod

 

[woodypei]

joseimuke — a game/project aimed at female audience, not necessarily has romance or female protagonist. joseimuke games/projects: ensemble stars (male idols, mc is a girl but theres no romance), helios rising heroes (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), touken ranbu (mc is sexless, all playable characters are male), hypnosis mic (no mc, most characters are male), stand my heroes/break my case (female mc but no dedicated routes, all playable characters are male)

amare — a romance game that features love interests of various sex and/or a protagonist with choosable sex. games like trapped with jester, how to date an entity (and stay alive), killer chat, 14 days with you, blooming panic, our life and many others
for comparison, otome — a romance game with female mc and male love interests

Stand My Hero actually has dedicated routes! They are very good plot wise and romance. It's an otome game