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Thread: Japanese sentence translation

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    Japanese sentence translation

    Hello,
    I am a beginner Japanese learner and I am trying to learn Japanese by attempting to analyze every Japanese sentence (to understand the grammar).

    And here, this sentence that has been bugging me for a while...
    海を追放されることに 何か理由があるかも

    My Translation :
    To the thing that sea people get (are) punished, there is some reason to this

    Question 1 : Why must the particle (に) be used and how does it give meaning to the sentence?
    Question 2 : I'm not very sure, but could it be (かも) is used to say "might" in Japanese?

    Thanks.

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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Quote Originally Posted by megafunc View Post
    Hello,
    I am a beginner Japanese learner and I am trying to learn Japanese by attempting to analyze every Japanese sentence (to understand the grammar).

    And here, this sentence that has been bugging me for a while...
    海を追放されることに 何か理由があるかも

    My Translation :
    To the thing that sea people get (are) punished, there is some reason to this

    Question 1 : Why must the particle (に) be used and how does it give meaning to the sentence?
    Question 2 : I'm not very sure, but could it be (かも) is used to say "might" in Japanese?

    Thanks.
    A little correction. 追放 doesn't mean to punish.
    追放 means to banish/exile/deport a person or to drive a harmful thing out.

    Translation:
    The banishment to the sea, there might be some reason behind it.
    or
    There might be some reason behind the banishment to the sea.

    Answer 1 : In the case of verb いる or ある, the particle に is used to indicate the location of existence.

    For example, テーブルの上リンゴあります。 = There are apples on the table.

    This isn't limited to something physical though, as we can see in your sentence.

    海を追放されること何か理由あるかも。
    Here, 何か理由 (some reason) exists in 海を追放されること (banishment to the sea)

    Answer 2 : Yes. かも is かもしれない shortened. It indicates the speaker's uncertainty.

    Hope this helps. o/
    Last edited by Frankincense; June 8th, 2015 at 08:40 AM.
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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Quote Originally Posted by megafunc View Post
    Hello,
    I am a beginner Japanese learner and I am trying to learn Japanese by attempting to analyze every Japanese sentence (to understand the grammar).

    And here, this sentence that has been bugging me for a while...
    海を追放されることに 何か理由があるかも

    My Translation :
    To the thing that sea people get (are) punished, there is some reason to this

    Question 1 : Why must the particle (に) be used and how does it give meaning to the sentence?
    Question 2 : I'm not very sure, but could it be (かも) is used to say "might" in Japanese?

    Thanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankincense View Post
    A little correction. 追放 doesn't mean to punish.
    追放 means to banish/exile/deport a person or to drive a harmful thing out.

    Translation:
    The banishment to the sea, there might be some reason behind it.
    or
    There might be some reason behind the banishment to the sea.

    Answer 1 : In the case of verb いる or ある, the particle に is used to indicate the location of existence.

    For example, テーブルの上リンゴあります。 = There are apples on the table.

    This isn't limited to something physical though, as we can see in your sentence.

    海を追放されること何か理由あるかも。
    Here, 何か理由 (some reason) exists in 海を追放されること (banishment to the sea)

    Answer 2 : Yes. かも is かもしれない shortened. It indicates the speaker's uncertainty.

    Hope this helps. o/

    In my impression, this question seems to be pretty difficult. I read the original question and the reply by Frankincense several times, but could not find how to explain.
    Basically, there aren't the context and the background of this sentence. And this sentence is a bit strange.

    Translation by megafunc:
    > To the thing that sea people get (are) punished, there is some reason to this

    Surely "追放" and punishment are different. But there is no Japanese word corresponding to "people" in "sea people". Where did this word "people" come from?

    I suppose the situation of the sentence may suggest : The people (who live in that sea) are banished out of (from) their sea, (this is punishment to them), and there might be some reason of this event (action / punishment)....

    Then, the reason of using particle "に" may be pretty complicated.
    But anyway, some particle (certain particle) is required in this case.

    You may be confused, but the following sentences have meanings and effective:

    海を追放されること 何か理由があるかも
    海を追放されることには 何か理由があるかも
    海を追放されること 何か理由があるかも

    As to the fact (action) that they will be banished out of the sea, there may be some reason(s) /in it/....

    :: 海を追放されることには 何か理由があるかも知れない

    The above is the possibly orthodox form of the sentence (this is supposition only).
    The cited sentence may be shortened form of the above sentence.

    :: A: 学校に 悪魔がいる。 :: In our school, there is a devil.
    :: B: 学校には 悪魔がいる。 :: As to our school, there is a devil /in it/.

    に (NI) shows simple fact, "location of existence" (by Frankincense).
    には (Niwa) shows a bit impression of emphasis. One interpretation: "Especially in our school, thee is (even) a devil." (a bit emphasis effect).

    But difficult.

    C1:: 彼女が叱られたことに みんな驚いた。 :: At the fact that she was scolded, students were surprised (at).
    C2:: 彼女が叱られたことには みんな驚いた。 :: At the fact that (especially) she was scolded, students were surprised (at). (a bit emphasized)

    D1:: 彼女が叱られたことには 何か理由がある。 :: As to the fact that she was scolded, there might be some reason /in it/. (a bit emphasized)
    D2:: 彼女が叱られたことに 何か理由がある。 :: As to the fact that she was scolded, there might be some reason /in it/. same meaning, usage, "simplified expression".

    に and には in C and D, they seem to have different functions.

    "彼女が叱られたこと" is a fact. What is the following statement.

    In the Case C, it is "simple reaction" of students.
    In the Case D, it is "supposed cause" of event/situation etc.

    In English, there is preposition "by".

    "Stand by me" -- location.
    "Earthquake was caused by the anger of gods" -- not location, rather showing "actor of event".

    "In the room" -- location.
    "In this manner" -- not location, (rather, mode, aspect of action)

    :: They dance in the room.
    :: They dance in this manner.

    There may be difference between first "in" and second "in".


    _ mrd

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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Well, I get the answers. Indeed, they were very informative. Basically, I care about grammar but I particularily tend to decide what that sounds the most natural so that I can soon use Japanese in my daily conversations.

    I want to keep it short, so how about...
    あなたたちは私の日本の最初の問題をへープしてくれたことには、ありがとうございました
    (As to the fact that you both helped me with my first Japanese problem, thanks)
    -> Thank you for helping me with my first Japanese problem

    Ok, here comes another challenge :
    海を追放されることも 何か理由があるかも
    My translation :
    As to the very fact that even people (who live in that sea) get banished out of their sea, there might be some reason in it.

    Question 1 : If I replace the particle (に) with different particles (for example, も or は), can it possibly change the original meaning of the sentence? Does it still sound natural, at least?

    And...
    最低なやつだったら 殴ってやる
    いいやつだったら 軽く殴ってやる

    My translation :
    If he appeared to be a bad guy, I'm going to punch him
    If he appeared to be a good guy, I will punch him gently

    Question 2 : I tried to extract these from some complex sentences in a dialogue, but I don't know whether or not they are grammatically correct. I highly doubt that the particle (ら) carries the meaning of (If). Can I replace (だった) with (だ) so that the sentences have the meaning of "Present Tense"?

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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Hi megafunc. Always happy to help.

    *Warning: wall of texts ahead*



    あなたたちは私の日本の最初の問題をへープしてくれたことには、ありがとうございました
    First, a few comments on this sentence.

    1. Don't forget to end your sentence with .

    2. 私の日本の最初の問題
    Perhaps it's better to rearrange it to 私の最初の日本の問題.

    3. へープ
    If you want to write "help" in katakana, the correct spelling would be へルプ. Even so, it still sounds awkward. Instead, I suggest you use the verb 助ける, which means "to help".

    4. ~してくれたことには、ありがとうございました
    When you want to thank someone for doing something for you, you can also just say ~て くれて ありがとう.
    (助けてくれてありがとう).

    Also, I think it's more natural to say ありがとうございます than to say ありがとうございました even though both express your gratitude.

    5. Actually, you can omit all the pronouns in this sentence and it will still pretty much retain the same meaning. That sounds more natural for me.

    So, If I were to rewrite this sentence, It would be 最初の日本の問題を助けてくれてありがとうございます。, though you can leave the formality out and just say 助けてくれてありがとう。. =D



    To the main questions. I'll try not to be confusing.

    Answer 1:

    海を追放されることに何か理由があるかも。

    Using a different particle does change the nuance.

    I don't usually see being replaced with but I think you can, or you can also simply combine them, like 海を追放されること何か理由があるかも。.

    海を追放されること何か理由があるかも。 would mean "There might also be some reason behind the banishment to the sea."

    (Earlier, the speaker or someone inferred that something had happened and there had been some reason behind it. Now the speaker says there is some reason behind the banishment as well.)

    The answer for 海を追放されること何か理由があるかも。 is already in mildis's post.

    is used to emphasize something. It indicates the sentence's topic. The sentence's topic can be almost anything. It can be the subject, the object, or anything that's relevant to what the speaker is trying to convey. It depends on where or what you want to put the emphasis on.

    Here, makes 海を追放されること the topic. The direct translation of 海を追放されること何か理由があるかも。 would be "As to the banishment to the sea, there might be some reason". The reason in this sentence can mean "the reason behind the banishment to the sea" or the reason behind something else (with the banishment to the sea as the topic).

    This direct translation is just to show you the nuance behind the particle . Actually, there is no topic marking particle in English. The closest word or phrase in English used to convey the nuance of would be "as to", "as for" or "concerning", but using that all the time in English would sound unnatural and should be avoided.

    You can also combine with , in which case it would become 海を追放されること何か理由があるかも。. The nuance is slightly different. In this case, "in the banishment to the sea" becomes the topic, not just "the banishment to the sea".

    Answer 2:

    最低なやつだったら殴ってやる。
    いいやつだったら軽く殴ってやる。


    I don't think is classified as a particle here, and you can only use た-form verb. It's how you write Japanese conditional form, the たら form (た-form verb + ).

    Example
    明日雨が降ったら、私は家にいます。
    I will stay home if it rains tomorrow.

    On a side note, the word 最低 carries a superlative meaning. It means "worst" or "lowest".

    Hope this helps.
    Last edited by Frankincense; June 14th, 2015 at 07:23 AM.
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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    So from my point of view, I think it's safe to use the particle (に) all the time whenever I see this pair (いる / ある). And when necessary, I will consider combining (に) with (も) or (は) to give my sentences some additional effect.

    Wow, I feel like I can understand everything. Hi, and thanks a bunch, かわいい[Frankincense]さん!

    あの, how about my first "Japanese literature"...
    私は、日本語勉強することは楽しくて ほんとうに面白くて ときどき難しくて

    でも 毎日毎日愛と(日本語を)勉強して読んだら いすか いすか
    あなたみたいに [mildis] さんみたいに 日本語を言ってできるかもっ思って。。。

    (As for me), learning Japanese is fun, really interesting but pretty difficult sometimes

    ...but if I (can) get to study and read it with love everyday, I think I might be even able to speak Japanese like you and mildis someday... =D


    Ok, and here they come...

    01. 昔、 夜中 小さい小さい泣き声が。。。
    02. 私は、永遠に輝き続ける
    03. (Oops... need more examples)

    My translation :
    01. At midnight, I used to hear my little sister's small, (soft) crying voice...
    02. As for me, I want to shine forever.

    Question 1 : What is the hiragana (き) doing here? Why can it connect to a noun or a verb in a way that I really really don't know?

    And...

    01. おい そこのお前
    02. おい そこのあなた

    My translation : (Hey, you!)

    Question 2 : I have trouble imagining the situation in which I should use (そこのお前) or (そこのあなた). What exactly are the differences between them and could you tell me how to use them properly?

    By the way, not sure if this one is correct. I practically tried to speak Japanese using (〜せて) that I've just "learnt", but I think it might end up becoming a failure :

    宿題しなかったら、ここにお付き合いしなせてできませんって
    My mother said, "Until you finish your homework, I can't let you leave the house"

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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Hi megafunc.

    Allow me to make a comment on your sentence. =D

    私は、日本語勉強することは楽しくて ほんとうに面白くて ときどき難しくて

    でも 毎日毎日愛と(日本語を)勉強して読んだら いすか いすか
    あなたみたいに [mildis] さんみたいに 日本語を言ってできるかもっ思って。。。
    1. I'm not sure if it's acceptable to have two は in the same sentence in written Japanese (because it would mean two topics exist in the same sentence) but I think it's fine if you're speaking casually. Another way to say this would be "私は日本語勉強すること ……".

    2. The 〜て form shouldn't be used to connect contradictory adjectives. (難しい is contradictory to 楽しい and 面白い.) You might want to use a contradictory conjunction (が, けど, けれど, etc.) here. Also, the last adjective in the series mustn't be in 〜て form.
    Example : 楽しくて面白いけど難しい。

    3. Use particle で to indicate a tool or a means used for an action. That would be 勉強する。(愛と勉強する means you and love study together.)

    4. The correct spelling of いすか is いつか (someday).

    5. If you want to say "like me or mildis" in Japanese, you can say あなたmildisさんみたい

    6. If you want to say "to speak a language (Japanese)" in Japanese, use verb 話す instead of 言う. (日本語を話す。)

    7. To say that you can do something, use dictionary form verb + ことができる (日本語を話すことができる。) or simply use potential form verb with particle が (日本語が話せる。).

    8. Use particle と or って for direct quotation. (〜って思う)




    To the main questions.

    Answer 1 :

    私は、永遠に輝き続ける。
    This is translated to "I continue to shine forever."
    "To want to continue to shine" would be 輝き続けたい.

    The き here is neither a particle nor something that has a meaning on its own. It's just a part of the verb stem.

    泣き is the stem of 泣く and 輝き is the stem of 輝く.

    This is continuative form (連用形: renyoukei), more commonly known as "masu stem" because it's the stem of the 〜ます form. It has so many uses that I can't list them all here, but in this case, it's used to create compound words. (泣き声 = 泣き + 声 = crying voice. 輝き続ける = 輝き + 続ける = continue to shine.)

    This page might provide a better explanation: http://www.epochrypha.com/japanese/m...rule=renyoukei

    Answer 2 : お前 is a second-person pronoun like あなた. It's a derogatory pronoun used to refer to someone with equal or lower status.

    Both sentences mean, "Hey, you there," but おい、そこのお前。 sounds less respectful.




    What is the 〜せて you've just learned? Could you possibly mean causative verb?
    Last edited by Frankincense; June 20th, 2015 at 11:17 AM.
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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    1.
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankincense
    What is the 〜せて you've just learned? Could you possibly mean causative verb?
    Yes, that's it! I was wondering why I couldn't figure its grammatical name out. And more importantly, I found that (くれる) is used together with causative verb to mean "let someone do something" in Japanese. Really, what a discovery! [Frankincense]さん、助けてくれてありがとう!

    2.
    http://www.jref.com/japanese/renyoukei/

    Renyoukei is an even bigger world than I thought. I get the answer but, I'll be sure to take my sweet time learning them slowly, slowly on demand (At least I don't need to complicate myself now =D)

    3.
    Actually, I really love rabbits. So that's why I could make this =D

    おうちにうさぎがあります。小さいけど、とてもかわいくて頭がいいです。名前は、「ルビ」です。ルビちゃんの髪の毛はとても白い。庭は大きいが、たくさん遊び場所がある。最高のことのはルビちゃんが食べてる。人が時時来て、ルビちゃんを見ることができるよ。でもね ルビちゃんが知らない人を見たら、いすもひみつの場所に逃げるんだ。それでも ルビちゃんが全然恥ずかしくない、私が近くいたら。ルビちゃんは私がルビちゃんのことにハグさせるくれて、ラブさせるくれて、キスさせるくれるよ。つまり、ルビちゃんは私のことが大好き。私もルビちゃんのことが大好きで、手でルビちゃんの眠い顔を見てることにいつも時間があるんだね。

    I have one rabbit at my house. Despire being small, she is totally cute and smart. Her name is, "Rubi". She has a totally white hair. She has a big garden, so she has a lot of places to play. The "loveliest" thing about her is when she is eating. People (often) come so that they can see her. However she always tends to run to her secret place to hide whenever she sees strangers. Still, Rubi-chan is not afraid at all when I am near her. She let me hug her, rub her and even kiss her. In other words, she really loves me. I also love her too, and I always have a lot of time enjoying watching her sleeping face in my hands...

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    This time, I will try asking my questions in Japanese. And I also want to hear you answer in Japanese too =D

    質問 1 : いつもあなたを見ることができるけど、あなたのうさぎに何してるの?
    英語 : I can always see you, but what are you doing to your "rabbit"? =D

    ところで [Frankincense]さん、うさぎが。。。好きですか? 嫌いですか?

    質問 2 : あなたの好きな色はなんですか。なんで?
    英語 : What is your favorite color? And why (do you like it)?
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    じゃあ 、答えはよろしく(お願いします)!
    Last edited by megafunc; June 27th, 2015 at 12:44 PM.

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    Re: Japanese sentence translation

    Hi megafunc.

    Good job writing a story. Writing is a very good way to improve your language.

    Try not to forget to conjugate verbs, and I see you're trying to use renyoukei to create compound words. Note that making compound words with renyoukei doesn't always work. You might want to memorize those compound words one by one, case by case. When in doubt, consult a dictionary.

    That's all I want to say for now, but if you want a more detailed comment let me know. =D




    1. もちろん煮て食べる。

    ウサギが大好きだよ。ウサギ汁がとても美味しい。^^

    2. 好きな色は白だ。理由がないけど。
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